When you think of narcissists, celebrities may be the first to come to mind — but according to Dr. Donna Rockwell, it might not totally be their fault.

Famous people eventually lose their capacity to interact normally with people because they’re so used to people like us — non celebrities — gawking at them and putting them up on a pedestal, she explained at a panel exploring the mind-body connection at the Third Metric women’s conference.

“So the famous person kind of loses their capacity to really be with other people because they’re out of practice for it. Again, they have neurons that are bundled in a different way now,” she said. However, she did name one intervention that could help: Mindfulness.

For more on what Rockwell has to say about narcissism and celebrities, watch the clip above.